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Post by Draven on Dec 12, 2021 12:51:42 GMT -6
I really wanted to try a VPA riser - 13" - with my Border Hex 6.5 longs and when opportunity arrived I bought the riser. There are conflicting info regarding how much draw weight will gain the limbs from a 25" riser to the 13" riser. My Borders are rated #55@28" on 25". On my Black Wolf 17" riser they were #64@28" and on this riser they gained almost nothing - #64.7. The single bow I enjoyed to shoot with a #58 AMO is DH Mamba and this 58" AMO bow (13"+longs) feels like a 60" AMO bow. I love it! I've set it at #62 OTF and it's the ultimate squirrels killer! 
About the riser / bow itself: - weight full bow as in image: 2.47lbs. This is just a tad above the 1 piece recurve weight, or on par with a whole wood takedown bow. - the riser has on the pocket a centreline that matches the centreline on the ILF system - a sweet addition compared with any other risers I have (Satori, Black Wolf, WFL, FC-100) making very easy the setup IF the limbs you have are straight. - the Jagger grip fits perfect in my hand - the small sight window is not hindering me even when shooting "straight bow". The top of the sight window is in the picture, but it doesn't bother me (I might use it as an aiming device later on if I want to use gaps at the riser)   If you are into short bows, I think this combo (small riser and supercurves) is the best to date. |
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Post by Rick Barbee on Dec 12, 2021 13:54:51 GMT -6
I wish ILF riser manufacturers would get their act together, and have a standard angle to be used on the limb pads across the board. The limb pad angle is probably why you only gained 0.7 # on the VPA riser.
But, this is the ILF world we live in. One size, or one formula for all, is not always the case, even when they say it is. LOL
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Post by Draven on Dec 12, 2021 14:03:03 GMT -6
The limb pad angle is 20 in this one, the usual angle is around 18. I believe there is a thought in having 20 degrees on small riser like this since you might stress the limb past the limit if it was marked on 25" riser. Imagine gaining 12 lbs just from the riser difference and add 5% on top of this. For a #40 limb you are stressing it close to an extra 40%.
Even if the limb pad angle would be the same, the manufacturers are weighting their limbs different. Black Wolf / Win&Win in general is marking the limbs with the bolts wound out. So, whatever you see on the limb is the minimum on their risers. Some others are making on the limb the draw weight at 26.5 DL and the 5% overall gain, basically the median weight is on the limb but you don't know which manufacturer is doing this. Koreans are like this.
PS The ILF is a trickster, actually you need the full bow from same company to be "right on the money" the rest is trial. The Formula / Hoyt at least were straight forward: to shoot our limbs you need our riser.
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Post by Rick Barbee on Dec 12, 2021 14:22:04 GMT -6
I wish UKHA would make limbs in the 65# range rated on a 21" riser.
Same goes for Morrison.
Guys who shoot heavier draw weights are being considered less & less as the years go by.
It SUX !!!
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Post by Rick Barbee on Dec 12, 2021 14:27:28 GMT -6
I have seriously considered building my own ILF limbs (for my JC Optimus riser), and copy one of the super hook, or super static profiles when I do.
I've built standard glass wood recurves in the past, and had good results,
but I know the supper hook, or super static profiles will be a challenge.
I have no doubt I can do it. Building the form, and getting it right will be the hardest part.
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Post by Draven on Dec 12, 2021 14:32:22 GMT -6
The single limb I know #65@28" on a 17" riser is the Black Wolf by W&W. Actually I have a #60 coming to me in a week. That #65 is #70 on BW and you might get the #65@28" on your 21" riser. I mounted on my Black Bear warf the #50 and it is #50 on it wound in. On your riser it might gain 1-2 pounds on top of that. The limb is a hell of the limb performance wise. Adding the extra 1" of your draw you will be happy with it, I am sure. If you were not that far from here, I would have shipped my Borders (they are longs) and I bet you would not be disappointed and use it to make your form. But when I talked with Border - I have a 19" riser in works - they told me they don't do above #60 on 25" riser.
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Post by Rick Barbee on Dec 12, 2021 14:50:07 GMT -6
The single limb I know #65@28" on a 17" riser is the Black Wolf by W&W. Actually I have a #60 coming to me in a week. That #65 is #70 on BW and you might get the #65@28" on your 21" riser. I mounted on my Black Bear warf the #50 and it is #50 on it wound in. On your riser it might gain 1-2 pounds on top of that. The limb is a hell of the limb performance wise. Adding the extra 1" of your draw you will be happy with it, I am sure. If you were not that far from here, I would have shipped my Borders (they are longs) and I bet you would not be disappointed and use it to make your form. But when I talked with Border - I have a 19" riser in works - they told me they don't do above #60 on 25" riser. I'll check them out.  |
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Post by Draven on Dec 12, 2021 14:53:02 GMT -6
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Post by Rick Barbee on Dec 12, 2021 15:22:37 GMT -6
I was looking at those earlier. If I weren't stuck on a set of super hooks I would probably give them a go. |
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Post by Draven on Dec 12, 2021 15:27:17 GMT -6
I have the #50 and soon the #60. Very smooth and snappy. You’ve seen me shooting them in the BW topic. The arrow I was shooting is 550gr for a #51 OTF setup.
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Hutch
New Member
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Post by Hutch on Dec 14, 2021 21:48:21 GMT -6
I liked the vpa riser I had. I mated it to a set of max 6 longs. Very nice combo 👍
Hutch
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Post by Draven on Dec 15, 2021 19:02:23 GMT -6
Agreed Hutch. I think this riser and long SC is one of the best mix and match in ILF world
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Hutch
New Member
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Post by Hutch on Dec 16, 2021 21:08:42 GMT -6
I will say this though, the plastic limb bolt bushings??? C'mon, really??
I'll get another vpa riser. But I'll have a different set of bushings for it.
Hutch
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Post by Draven on Dec 17, 2021 9:39:46 GMT -6
Spot on Hutch! I have extra bolt bushing bought long time ago on ebay from hawkeye (before his death)  |
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Post by Draven on Dec 19, 2021 18:22:46 GMT -6
I went tonight to indoor to shoot the bow. Educating experience. I love the feel, I love the bow but I need 200 spine arrows - maybe with a shorter 250 spine I can get away. The 320 spine I had were very weak. A friend who’s shooting compound gave me to try his 200 spine with 140gr tip and were perfect. Shortening to 29” maybe a 250 will do. On this riser I think the limbs are opening their tip a tad more at my draw and the efficiency of them goes up. On the 17” I made the 320 to work but not on this one. My friend was impressed when I told him the lowest arrow weight I could test is 660 gr - considering the speed was reaching the target at 20yards. Oh well, in the search for 200/250 spine arrows now.
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Post by Draven on Jan 30, 2022 12:02:47 GMT -6
I decided to use the VPA riser for my longbow Dryad Epic limbs. The limbs are marked #46@28" on a 19" riser and now are #48.5@28" on this riser, tiller bolts all in. It feels very good and is starting to stack around 29".   The Borders will go on a 17" Tempest |
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Post by Draven on Feb 11, 2022 10:48:42 GMT -6
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